Things like this just shouldn’t happen – after releasing two great albums under the name Janet Gardner along comes album number three, billed this time as Gardner/James and it’s better still. The song-writing partnership of Janet Gardner and Justin James really is something special, and of all the stars of the 80’s still making music today Gardner has already eclipsed the output of the band most associate with her, well as far as these ears are concerned anyway. Last time I talked to Janet and Justin it was over a coffee in a pre-coronavirus Melbourne, this time we’re safely socially distanced over several oceans…
Janet: Hello!
Mark: Hi guys how are you?
Justin: Good.
Janet: Good how are you doing?
Mark: Not too bad at all thank you.
Janet: How are things Downunder, we miss you guys!
Mark: Well it’s interesting let’s put it this way! Here in the West we’re doing good, we don’t even know coronavirus exists over here, we closed our State borders and didn’t let anyone in and we have no cases.
Janet: That goes to show you.
Justin: That’s great.
Janet: Over here we’ve got 50 states doing different things and people going anywhere they want and it’s everywhere!
Mark: Melbourne is pretty crazy where we were though, it’s got a big second wave, but they’re in complete lockdown, they can’t get out of their houses at night and I know you’ll both want to know this – toilet paper in Melbourne is again scarce! (laughs)
Janet: No!
Justin: (laughs) we noticed that a day or two before we left it disappeared off the shelves!
Janet: Yeah we went to Coles (an Australian Grocery store) and there was none left.
Mark: (laughs) It’s very weird isn’t it. But it’s not all doom and gloom, some very good things have come out of the lock-down! It’s not fair really – you guys – your second album in my opinion was better than the first and you’ve just gone and topped it again with the third, what’s happening?
Janet: (laughs)
Justin: Thank you, thank you. Your review definitely put a huge smile on our faces. It stinks that we can’t go out and tour and promote it right now but on the flip side of things the things we got to do with you and right before this thing kicked in it was great and we really appreciate that we got to do something that both of us always wanted to experience.
Janet: Yeah, we snuck in a bucket-list thing right before the lock-down.
Mark: (laughs)
Janet: We just got home in the nick of time.
Justin: Yeah, we got home three days before they locked down The States, not that we would have minded to have been stuck out there but family and everything else is here, so it was so lucky that we just managed to sneak back in on time.
Mark: Yeah it was tight, I spoke to Chip (Z’Nuff) the other day and he said they just made it, they were supposed to be playing in Europe after Australia.
Janet: Yeah Italy and then the UK and all of that got canned.
Mark: And so the last date you ever played was…
Janet: The Melodic Rock Fest in Melbourne Australia.
Mark: And that was actually one of the last shows a lot of people saw over here by an international artist. I did see that you had some dates coming up though fingers-crossed all things being safe?
Justin: We had some Summer Festivals over here in the States that unfortunately got postponed until next year. But we were supposed to do a big one in October in Mexico with Billy Idol and Cheap Trick, now that would have been incredible, but things are what they are and now we have to wait till next year. But the one plus that came out of all this was that we were able to just lock ourselves away and write a new album, record it and get it out pretty darn quick after the last one.
Mark: It is remarkably productive, it almost reminds me of the old days of the 70’s where bands would sometimes release albums every year separated by touring cycles. So I’m expecting the fourth by Christmas, is that right?
Janet: (laughs).
Justin: (laughs) Absolutely! We do actually have three or four demos already for album number four, maybe we can outdo ourselves and do two a year!
Janet: (laughs).
Mark: Sounds good, and then tour them both! We’d love to have you back down here again of course!
Justin: Absolutely, travelling anywhere and going to different spots is always fun but coming to Australia, next time we come we want to bring our kids, it was just so gorgeous, everyone was just so cool and friendly, I can’t wait to get back.
Janet: It’s just not right that we were allowed to have that much fun!
Mark: (laughs) you should come and spend some time, we’d love to have you out West too.
Janet: And then we’ll have to go to the island where the quokkas are! (laughs)
Mark: You have been researching! That’s a short boat trip from us!
Justin: We have to do that.
Mark: As someone who reviews a lot of music, I was a bit worried when it got close to a release date and I still hadn’t written up a review of ‘Synergy’, it always happens when I’m enjoying an album so much – I just want to listen one more time, so I hope I was close with some of the comments? What I loved most was that wonderful mix of styles, it’s never boring, and I love to try and dissect it a bit wondering where you were heading with certain songs.
Janet: It’s funny because you absolutely nailed a few of your references in the review. When you mentioned Kenny Wayne Shepherd on ‘Rise Up’ that was exactly what I had in my head – that kinda Bluesy, swampy, Kenny Wayne vibe. You completely nailed that and nobody ever does that!
Mark: I think I only had that in my mind as Kenny was here just before you guys so he was fresh in the memory.
Janet: Man I was like “that guy has some keen insights!” (laughs)
Justin: When I read it I was amazed how close you nailed the songs and even the parts in some of the songs – it was almost scary because it was exactly what we were thinking. I know everyone has their own impressions and their own take on these things but it was like you were in our heads!
Janet: I said to Justin “Did we tell him about this?”
Mark: (laughs) I guess bits like on ‘Wounded’ where I mention that George Lynch sound, I think I spoke to Justin about George when we had coffee but I don’t think he mentioned that song.
Justin: That song started right before we came to Australia, I came up with the main riff and I was worried, I thought it might have been too busy and I wasn’t sure it would work and then Janet came up with this incredible vocal melody to go over it. And then when it came to that little break-down section just before the solo as soon as I came up with the first couple of notes I thought “This reminds me of something off an old Dokken album”.
Mark: (laughs).
Justin: So when you said that in the review I thought “Holy cow!”
Janet: I think we might have even said to each other “Is this too Dokken?” (laughs)
Mark: Can you be too Dokken? I’m not sure? (laughs)
Janet: (laughing) Of course not!
Justin: When you’re a fan there’s no ‘Too much!’
Mark: I honestly don’t know where to start with the songs, there’s some wonderful tracks on there and like all great albums I think every time I listen to it I pick up on something else. I did want to pick out a few though that I wanted to know a bit more about, the second video you put out ‘Lonely we Fight’ – tell us about that song?
Janet: Well it was during the lock-down and we had already written ’Talk To Myself’ which was more the lighter side of things, the humour of it.
Justin: No you got that backwards ‘Talk to Myself’ was last, that came after this.
Janet: Are you sure?
Justin: Yes ‘Talk to Myself was the last song that we wrote for the album.
Janet: Oh! Because you were drunk! (laughs)
Justin: (laughs) I will be honest I was drunk!
Mark: (laughs).
Janet: OK I remember, I started that one while you were at work. I did want to do something about the feelings of being on lock-down and the loneliness that comes with it, and the sadness. And I wanted to kinda capture that because everybody was feeling it, we were feeling it, and so I think I had most of the music done right?
Justin: Yes.
Janet: I played it pretty crappy though so I made Justin play most of my guitar parts (laughs) and actually we were lying in bed writing the lyrics, and that’s kinda where that one came from.
Justin: What made that song stand out for me and a little different was that it had that different sound to it, that kind of sitar thing going in the beginning that gave it a bit of an Indian feel, I think.
Janet: Yeah I had put that little line in there and then Justin, I think, said it needed more of that, so I changed that and that’s kind of where it ended up fitting. We re-did the bass part about ten times in the verse, it just didn’t feel right to me. We were doing eight notes for a while and then I was doing a moving thing, and one part was way too low and ‘dirgey’. So we ended up with that little ‘skippy’ part.
Mark: I love that bit.
Justin: Janet is just so good at coming up with these bass parts that just move so smoothly and just help the song just develop. And then when it gets to that chorus, being a huge die-hard 80’s Kiss fan it just has this rhythm to it that gives it a melodic almost AOR huge chorus.
Janet: It was funny as Justin’s a huge Kiss fan and when he came home I said to him you’re not going to believe it but this thing I wrote today reminds me of Kiss. So Justin said “Well I’m sure I’m gonna like it then.”
Justin: I was told (laughs).
Mark: (laughs) I loved the ballads too and I think ‘Say You Will’ is my pick, I was getting Def Leppard and The Beatles all the way through and I couldn’t decide so I threw them both in. I love the part just before it gets to the solo.
Justin: Oh that’s awesome, that was another one you hit right on the head, because right before the solo we definitely go into this Beatlesy-vibe, but during the verse of that song we were kind of, being huge Def Leppard fans, wanting something almost like ‘Love Bites’ that clean guitar – Steve Clarke type guitar with these rhythmic hits in the background.
Janet: There’s lots of echoey rhythmic things going on trying to create a mood. Mutt Lange was the master of that, and Def Leppard too the way they write their songs. And the weird Beatles part in the middle was something I just started doing on the strings and we were not sure about it. I thought is this too ‘out of left field?’ and we went back and forth and we’re gonna change it and then we thought ‘Screw that!’, it’s unpredictable, but you know, if you keep with the boring formulas then it’s just gonna be boring, so we went with it.
Mark: I love it and the album is so beautifully produced as well, you guys have done a great job.
Janet: Thank you.
Justin: Oh thank you I so appreciate that. That was another thing to do with this album. We started writing this album on New Year’s Eve and we knew it was going well, but while we were working we didn’t know it was going to come together as fast as it did. We were on lock-down so we had a lot of time to dive into it but the flip side of that is we were going so fast through it that you end up with the question – “Is it produced right? Is it mixed right” And everyone has their own personal taste and what sounds like a masterpiece to one person might sound bad to another. So I was a little neurotic and paranoid when we were producing this and putting it together thinking “I hope it sounds good, I hope we didn’t rush this.” At the end of the day I think we did OK?
Janet: Sometimes I think it’s good that you don’t overthink it because that can get you in trouble too. You change it, you change it, you re-do it, you fix little things and then it sounds bad and you start again. You can overthink it to death so you know we listen carefully to all of the songs and try and work out, “Do these come out like we want them to?” And once we got to the point where we both kind of said “Yeah, I think so,” that was it.“Let’s do it.”
Mark: Well I for one love how it sounds. There was one song that stumped me though so I kinda hedged my bets – ‘On a Wire’…
Janet: Ah!
Mark: That’s a really complex song for me.
Justin: We were just talking about this earlier. Somebody asked what were our two favourite songs on the album, and of course it’s so hard to pick one. For me currently right now that probably is my favourite song on the album. It’s different, and ironically the main part to that song the way it starts I actually wrote that melody during the recording of ‘Your Place in the Sun’. We didn’t use it, we pretty much had that whole album completed and so we moved on, then we brought it back and Janet came up with this nice clean verse part that brings it down a little bit. But the thing I love about that song is that it layers, and it just builds and builds until it gets to the chorus and then it really opens up. To me, I love the band ‘Giant’ and it just reminds me of something when it gets to that chorus – almost like a ‘Giant’ sounding chorus. It’s not simple, it’s a little more complex but I think it’s one of those that the more you listen to it the more it kinda hits you, and those to me are the songs that stick with you longer.
Mark: Yeah. It’s interesting you say that because at the moment there are two for me, and it changes every day, but today, which is Tuesday in Australia but Monday for you guys…
Janet: (laughs)
Mark: It’s that one ‘On a Wire’, and also something completely different that I keep playing in the car – ‘Gone’
Justin: Ahh!
Janet: (laughs).
Mark: Completely different songs, which says a lot about the variety on the album.
Janet: ‘Gone’ is one of those that doesn’t have any profound deep meaning but it’s just a fun rock and roll tune, and that’s what that one was. It came together super-fast – I wrote it in a day.
Justin: It’s one of those songs too that I think when we were writing and recording it you need that fun ‘live’ song that you don’t need to think too hard about, but when you play it live it’s gonna be supercharged and really get people going! You’re right when that one comes on it takes a completely different turn from the one before and the following song ‘Flying on Faith’. It’s just a feel-good fun little song and another little thing with that for us is our daughter actually helped sing some of the gang-vocals on that song to make it even bigger. It was the first time we’d ever convinced one of our kids to take part in our recordings. To them we’re dorks and completely uncool!
Mark: (laughs).
Justin: But as parents to have one of our kids on there!
Janet: Our sons wanted nothing to do with it (laughs) but she’s on there and it was fun because it’s so upbeat and everyone was kinda bopping around the house.
Mark: And as you say you end with a great track in ‘Flying on Faith’. The other song I wanted to mention is ‘Talk to myself’ – again a different type of song, I think I described it as Pop Punk meets Rock and Roll and I had to get the Rocky Horror Picture show reference in there too, it sounded like it could have been off a modern take on that soundtrack.
Janet: (laughs).
Justin: You nailed that one! That song was weird it was during the whole lock-down thing and it was probably about one or two in the morning, Janet was asleep and I was just watching TV. I had a couple of beers and I had a pretty decent buzz going.
Mark: (laughs).
Justin: So I went down into our studio and started noodling on the guitar playing that riff, I was honestly just trying to come up with something weird, just to goof around and I was definitely not in the right headspace. And I think I woke Janet up because I was playing it too loud on the monitor speakers not realising. And she said “What are you doing?” I just said I was messing around, it was just a throw-away song but I played it for her. And she said “Oh I like that, I could do something with that.”
Janet: But it was still too weird though, it was just kinda fun. I knew we should do something with it.
Mark: It’s a lovely twist, a song that makes you wonder what’s happening next?
Janet: Yeah.
Justin: It came together so nicely, because originally we were gonna do the video for ‘Lonely we Fight’ but we figured during lock-down who cares, there really are no rules of music today, let’s just put out a single and give people something to listen to because we can’t do live shows. And then when we did ‘Talk to Myself’ it was the polar opposite – it was the same kind of situation being stuck in lock-down but it was in a goofy light-hearted fun way. We had to put that one out right away. I think Janet came up with the lyrics the next day and got it all done in one day. That thing came together so fast.
Janet: Yeah it was so fun. And then of course I said to Justin: “We should do a goofy video” you know in our bathrobes and slippers just going crazy round the house, jumping on the bed, losing our minds. We got the kids in it, but Justin wasn’t feeling it!
Justin: Mark I resisted as much as I could! (laughs)
Janet: So I kind of bullied him into it! (laughs). I said “C’mon, let’s just film something! Relax, just have fun with it” I told him I’d edit it and if it looks stupid we don’t have to put it out, we would just pretend we never did it. So he (laughs) begrudgingly, reluctantly allowed me to film some stuff and I think people appreciated it. We have to wash our hands 50 times a day, we’re doing what everyone else is doing and we’re all going crazy! It was a fun way to end the album too.
Mark: Oh definitely. So I love the album, we’ve talked about a few of the tracks, and you’ve already promised me a new one by Christmas so I’m happy.
Janet: (laughs).
Mark: I just have a question for Justin here: now that we’re in the Gardner /James era, how long before we have a ‘Justin James featuring Janet Gardner’ album?
Janet: (laughing).
Justin: Yeah, the next might be the Justin James holiday special! (laughs)
Janet: (Laughing).
Mark: We can’t be too far away there! There’s also an anniversary this year, I love the anniversary questions. I always put up on social media who I’m talking to just to allow the readers to ask questions and someone pointed out that it was the 30th Anniversary of Vixen’s ‘Rev It Up’ this year.
Janet: Yeah that’s correct.
Mark: Now I have in my collection a single with a poster bag of ‘Not a Minute Too Soon’ which I think was only released in the UK?
Janet: You’re right about that too, we did a video just for the UK for that song. I remember seeing it on Top of the Pops in the UK for the first time with that song.
Janet: Before that we actually performed ‘Cryin’’ on Top of the Pops, Steve Plunket came up with “How Much Love’ and ‘Streets in Paradise’ which are two great songs too, so everybody kinda got to pitch in and it came out really great and Randy Nicklaus did a great job with keeping a great vibe and atmosphere with the recording. He produced it and Mike Shipley was amazing. His mixes took it to a different level. So the memories of that album are really, really good actually. We were all in a really good creative place and really enjoyed making that album together.
Mark: I think it’s maybe my favourite of the Vixen records but I must admit it’s your latest release that tops everything, it gets better with each release there’s not a lot of room to move!
Janet: But hey this Justin James Christmas album – it’s gonna top it all off! (laughs)
Mark: If that comes out I’ll want a credit for the concept at least on the back of the record! (laughs)
Justin: A limited edition of five copies will be available!
Mark: (laughs)
Justin: You won’t get that at the store! (laughs)
Mark: Thank you so much guys, I’ve taken up a lot of your time and it’s always great to speak. I’m glad I got somewhere close on the review. We’re in August now and it’s my album of the year so far so you’ve only got to hold on a little while longer.
Janet: Wow, thank you so much.
Mark: You’ve only got to hold out till Christmas, and then the Justin James Christmas album might just edge it!
Janet: With a special appearance by me!
Justin: I’ll let her be in the picture on the cover this time!
Janet: (laughs)
Justin: Maybe in the background?
Mark: (laughs) Guys thank you so much!
Janet: It’s been fun!
Justin: You too and hopefully we get to see you again soon because we are itching to come back.
Janet: And it’s so nice that when we talk to you now we have a face. I remember sitting down in the lobby of the hotel having that conversation so it’s really nice to talk to you again.
Mark: It’s great to talk to you guys, just keep doing what you’re doing and stay safe.
Janet: You too. Thank you so much. We can’t wait to come back to Australia, we loved the first time and we want more!
Justin: Thank you.
Mark: You both have a goodnight, I’ve got to go to work now!
