The Angels have always been my favourite Aussie Rock band. You can make your case for AC/DC all you like but for me there was and is just something special about the songs and the vibe of The Angels that still endures as we approach the band’s 50th Anniversary in 2024. Now you can see the story of the band for yourselves in a new documentary ‘The Angels: Kickin’ Down The Door’ in cinemas across Australia at the moment. It’s a great story so we called up John Brewster to talk all about it, fill in a few gaps and look at plans for the big anniversary just around the corner.
John: Now you’ve got me!
Mark: Great to see you John, we only saw you the other day in Perth when we finally got to see you do something a lot of people had been waiting over three years for!
John: I know, all this on again off again stuff that’s been going on it’s been frustrating, but gee it was fantastic. We just love Perth, the Perth audience was just amazing, but before we go on I have to get something which is absolutely essential… (John produces a glass of red wine) Cheers Mark!
Mark: And cheers to you too John! It was a wonderful night at the Orchestral show. I know that type of production has been put on before by many bands but I think out of all of the Orchestral performances I’ve seen, there was just something magical about that.
John: Thanks for the compliment Mark, I have to say I agree. There is something special about the show. The one thing I love about it is, well obviously to play our music with those wonderful arrangements that John came up with is wonderful in itself and to have a choir is also wonderful. But the thing I most love is that it gave us a chance to do ‘Outcast’ and to do ‘Dawn is Breaking’, you know, ‘My Light Will Shine’ and the song that Rick and I wrote ‘Would You Do It Again’ that we open the second set with. Just to be able to do those sort of songs amongst the others and the ‘Overture’ that we walk onto was written by Rick and my Grandfather.
Mark: It was wonderful and ‘Would You Do it Again’ especially I think had a lot of people tearing up who were sat near us, such an emotional moment in the set and brilliantly done.
John: Ah.
Mark: One of the things you mentioned in the set that night was that we are only a couple of years off the 50th Anniversary (of the band) and that there is even more coming!
John: Yeah! (Laughs) We are starting to put together plans for that now. I think amongst other things we will probably do an album with some guests, some from overseas and some of our Australian friends. To me that is part of the celebration, some of the people that we have influenced in America for example will come on board.
Mark: Thats great to hear, I know whenever I speak with Jack Russell of Great White the first thing he asks is how The Angels are, he’s always been a huge fan.
John: Yeah, of course they did ‘Can’t Shake It’ and “Face the Day’, they had quite a hit with ‘Face the Day’ in The States.
Mark: It will be great I’m sure and I don’t even want to ask who will be on there as I love a surprise. Aside from the future plans and the Symphony we now also have the documentary ‘Kicking Down the Door’ which I’ve just finished watching for the second time. I know it’s been out in limited cinema release for a while now, but there was footage in there I don’t think I’ve ever seen, where did that come from?
John: Yeah I know! And actually it’s not that limited either, it came out in 90 cinemas when released and that’s quite a major release there days.
Mark: That’s wonderful!
John: It’s very exciting. The thing is the movie was written and controlled by two people – our director Maddie Parry who is just fantastic: she’s a young woman in her early 30’s and the crew that worked on the movie were all young people. And Peter Hanlon who is the producer of the movie along with Mikael Borglund and Rick Davies. Peter has become a great friend of mine, he comes from a banking background and was right at the top of Westpac and retired down to Victor Harbor which is where I live, and he’s the most unretired retired person I’ve ever met! And on one of our walks he said to me “You know I have a film company?” and he told me that one of the first films he made, he went to film Punk bands in Iceland. He loves Punk music, so I said “Wow” you better do a movie on us! Anyway we started talking about it, and I was on my way to Sydney to stay with my friend Mikael Borglund who is the head of Beyond Entertainment. Michael used to be our accountant way back and so I said to Peter – you should come over and meet Mikael. So he did, and long story short and several bottles of Pinot Noir later they shook hands and went into partnership on the movie.
Mark: How much input did you have into the film John?
John: I had no input into how the movie was made or where the balance went. My job was really telling lots of stories and I tend to have a pretty good memory of what went on back in those days. And not everyone does believe me! (laughs)
Mark: Well you were the driver weren’t you John so you’re bound to have a better memory than those in the back seats!
John: Well yeah, I mean it was my idea to start the band and I was to a fault pretty much the leader of the band and there’s a positive side of that and a negative. And the negative at one stage might have got a bit too much for people in the mid 80’s – it was tough time and we were losing money hand over first. I say in the movie we would have brought up babies and houses we didn’t own anymore, and that’s not exaggerating. So my job was just commentating and I squirm a bit seeing how emotional I can get but Maddie is a good director and so she knew how to draw that emotion out. She made you go back there, you know, particularly talking about my Dad you know. I was sort of back there.
Mark: They were some of the most emotional moments for me, when you were talking about him early on and when you said that he never actually saw you play live. It really puts that realization right in front of you.
John: Yeah, yeah. He was a great guy he just was a victim of his own addictions at one stage, but to his credit managed to stop drinking. He never stopped smoking though and died from a heart attack at the age of 65. His dad was Hooper Brewster-Jones who was a concert pianist, composer, conductor – he was a big deal. It’s all his fault you see!
Mark: (laughs)
John: It’s that genetic thing flowing down the generations including my son, Rick’s son Jody – he was up on stage with us recently for a Symphony show playing Sax – he’s amazing. My grandfather dies just before I was born, I was born in 1949 and he died 4 months before I was born. He was only 62 and he was playing Mozart D minor concerto at the Adelaide Town Hall with Dad conducting him and the Symphony Orchestra; and he took his bows and went to join the family and dropped dead on the stairs. It’s a family legend and that’s why it means such a lot to us to have that little piece of his Symphony. It’s a Symphony he wrote called ‘Australia Felix’ and to walk on stage to that is quite a goosebump moment.
Mark: It is and it’s wonderful to tie it all together. There are some wonderful stories in the movie and yours were fantastic and it really did chart the ups and downs of the band and like all good stories do, it left a few doors open and left you wondering about things. Like what would have happened if you’d stayed in the States and things like that.
John: Well look, my commentary on that is, if we’d stayed in the States with the ‘Two Minute Warning’ album, and I think that album has a lot of merit, is that it’s a good album but it wasn’t the album to break America. Look we had our shot and it’s a bit like a moon shot, you know when you come back from the moon you have to find the right window; and I think we bounced off America…. But not completely. you might be quite surprised at how big we were particularly on the West Coast. There were certain regions – in Chicago we were big, New York and Los Angeles to a lesser extent, but the Midwest was difficult. But the biggest difficulty wasn’t the music – we were going over great wherever we played, the biggest difficulty was the costs of being there and that’s only worth continuing to pour money into, way and above the advances we were getting from record companies: that only works if you make it. But we never made it to the point where we weren’t losing money hand over fist. But Brent (Brent Eccles – Drums) said and I have a great amount of affection for Brent, when I left the band he just thought that the band would go back to America and stay there until they became one of the biggest bands. And I said “Good luck.” It wasn’t going to happen I knew it. And they never went back. It’s really difficult. AC/DC were our great friends and they left Australia at the right time. I think it was ’77 they left and they stayed there and they had it all, you know, they had Ted Albert behind them. We left Ted Albert which was a great tragedy. But Ted supported them so they didn’t have financial worries, they weren’t making a fortune at the start but they were fine. And we were a little bit older than those guys and we were starting to have kids, it’s hard enough touring Australia when you have kids let alone be overseas.
Mark: I can image. There are so many twists and turns in The Angels story. That meeting with AC/DC in ’75 sort of kickstarted things. But it must have been frustrating, you were releasing some great music that wasn’t charting. I loved that bit in the movie when you say that early motivation was to knock Sherbert off the top of the tree!
John: (laughs) I mean I’m friends with those guys so I’m a bit embarrassed that I set my sights on them. But the thing is they were the big deal at the time, so I just used them as an example of somebody that was at the top and I reckoned we could get to the top if we formed a band. Of course it took us four years. I said 12 months, it took us four years before we did that. And I’m not saying we knocked Sherbert off the top of the tree either, just that we got there. And when I look back on it, it was just fantastic but frustrating. We kept releasing singles and they all flopped one after the other, ‘Face Again’ was actually one of the biggest flops really, and now it’s absolutely huge, ‘Coming Down on Me’ is huge.
Mark: I heard the Choir singing the refrain back to you from ‘Face Again.’
John: (Laughs) Did the Orchestra do it to? I don’t know?
Mark: I think they were a bit more guarded. (Laughs)
John: (Laughs)
Mark: It’s easy to forget how much The Angels did change music in Australia. You mention in the documentary that it was a bit like when Nirvana came along and knocked off all of the Hair Metal bands at the start of the 90’s. But it sort of was like that in a way – you brought to the scene that harder edge with a touch of Punk and even and element of danger and art in there where Doc was concerned, but it wasn’t just Doc who was bringing that. Even when you listen to the lyrics of a song like ‘Mr. Damage’ now there’s that edginess.
John: Well you see Mr. Damage is all my Brother’s lyric “Holding council with the king and queen, trying hard to decide the fate of their regime” all that stuff Rick wrote that. My contribution was the chorus because it started with the verse and then the chorus (John sings) “Mr. Damage holds a curse. Mr. Damage drives a hearse. Don’t you know who did it first…” and then that bit. And I’m saying all this because it’s an example of how Rick and Doc and I worked. I said to Rick and I said “This needs a chorus” and I came up with “… Mr. Damage. Holding frozen hands as Mr., Holding frozen hands as Mr., Holding frozen hands as Mr., Damage holds the curse.” and then we get to this middle eight bit where we break down and Doc comes up with the “A leather flyer leaves the subway anxious to admit. That the marveled one so recently deposed was seen. Three days later in a brand new suit of clothes. A brand new suit of clothes for a very special day.” and that’s all Doc: that’s an example of why Brewster-Neeson-Brewster and a song writing partnership worked so well.
Mark: It certainly did and it’s worth mentioning that songs came about in other ways too like ‘I Ain’t the One” for example?
John: I wrote that one at a time when the band was at a very low ebb in ’77 when it really looked like we might not be able to go on as we were making nothing, playing every night of the week and it was difficult. So I flew from Sydney to Adelaide to see if my old man would help us out a bit and quite rightly he said “No.” He’d retired, he was secure and he was worried that it might affect my relationship with him, which it didn’t in the least, and I was sitting in a car in Adelaide and ‘I Ain’t the One’ just came into my head – that whole song. And it’s worth talking about because it was a tipping point. I went back to the studio with that. In the meantime Doc was in Adelaide too and he went to see Wal Cherry. Professor Wal Cherry was the head of drama at Flinders University, Doc and I studied Film Making and Drama there, and Wal gave Doc some ideas about being a front man at the same time as I wrote ‘I Ain’t the One’. So we went back to the studio and I showed it to the boys in the band and everyone went nuts. They went “We found our sound”. And that was never released as a single but two weeks later Rick comes back with ‘Take a Long Line’ and that’s in the same vein as ‘I Ain’t the One’. It’s a hugely great song and that made the difference and suddenly that was it. When we took off it was like a rocket ship taking off we went through the roof.
Mark: Was that something you saw at that moment as a turning point or did that come with perspective? It always struck me as being one of those ‘blinding flash of light’ moments?
John: Yeah we did because it happened both in the studio and then we put ‘I Ain’t the One’ on stage, and I think Raymond Hawkins talks about it in the movie where he was doing the door and there were bugger all people there and we used to alternate with the ‘disco machine’ you know! We hated disco! Though when look back on it now a lot of that disco in the 70’s was actually fabulous stuff! (laughs)
Mark: (laughs)
John: It really was, but at the time we hated it because it was our enemy. You know – the disco would be on and the dance floor would be full of girls dancing, and we’d hit the stage and the whole dance floor would just empty “Whfffft” just like that! Oh god! You know! And then this particular night that Raymond Hawkins talks about we put ‘I Ain’t the One’ in the set and ‘I Ain’t the One’ changed it. Suddenly people came forward and they stood in front of the band and they started rocking out, and we realized we had something going on. And then of course other songs got written like ‘Shadow Boxer’, well not then, but ‘Straightjacket’, and ‘Take a Long Line’ and stuff. And so we developed a repertoire that just grabbed people. And at the same time Doc comes up with this disheveled aristocratic look with the Ascot tie. And what he would do was he’d come out looking absolutely resplendent, like he was about to go to the races, you know, with a glass of champagne in one hand and through the performance he would just ‘dishevel’ and he’d finish up a wreck. It was all very theatrical – we used to talk about it being ‘intellectually menacing’ (Laughs)
Mark: (Laughs)
John: And it kind of was.
Mark: It had it all. Growing up, for me, in a completely different part of the world The Angels was always the Australian Rock band for me. And I know a lot of fans I talk to at shows know that – you are the best Australian Rock Band that ever walked the earth!
John: (Laughs)
Mark: There is that real joy and love amongst the fans and now in 2022 having a guy like Gleeso at the front there’s still that love, everyone loves that guy.
John: He’s fantastic.
Mark: You can never replace Doc of course but you can have a guy out front there who will honour that memory and who loves the music as much as we do.
John: The thing is Dave used to talk about having ‘big shoes to fill’ and I said to him, “Dave you’re not filling anyone’s shoes, you fill your own shoes” and he does. Of course Doc was an incredible front man, and Doc had his problems later in his life… but in comes Dave and he just brought this energy with him. The other thing about Dave is he’s really musical and that’s a musical voice, it’s a very powerful and very musical voice. He does what Harry Vanda used to call the ‘Circus bit’ (Laughs) that a front man does. And I think the Angels is a band that needs a front man. I’ve tried singing in a four piece when Doc left the band and it went pretty well. But I’ve never thought of myself as a front man. I can be for The Brewster Brothers funnily because it’s more conversational, but for The Angels you need that kind of energy that we had from Doc and we have in a very different way from Dave. I think Dave is wonderful. Really great.
Mark: He’s a lovely guy and he makes me laugh so much. I can barely get through an interview with him we laugh so much.
John: (Laughs) I know he’s been with us eleven years now and we’ve never had an argument. It’s a very happy camp and it’s quite interesting because you’ve got the two old guys Rick and me that have been there forever and Dave that’s been there eleven years and then my son Sam and Nick Norton who are around the 40 mark. So there’s three generations represented in this band and the friendship that we’ve built among the five of us is pretty fantastic. And we’re surrounded by great people.
Mark: Over the years members have come and gone and for many bands that changing of the guard would have received push back from the fans but Angels fans seem to be a little different and rightly so – the changes are pretty much universally embraced.
John: Yeah, well one of my favourite stories about Dave coming into the band in the beginning, and at that time Doc was still alive, Doc was doing his own thing. He’d left the band and we replaced Doc, and there was little bit of ‘Argie Bargy’ there for a while. We were playing in Melbourne doing this show and there was this married couple there and they were right down the front in front of Chris Bailey and me and they kept pointing at Dave and gesturing (John does the infamous gesture) and then they disappeared, so I went over to Chris and said “Thank god they’ve gone” and Chris said “Yeah they were pains in the arse”. And then they came back and put a Jim Beam and Coke can in front of me and one in front of Chris and then pointed at Dave and mouthed “Fantastic.” So suddenly they’d decided ‘wait a minute he’s not bad news, he’s great!’ (Laughs) I thought that was great.
Mark: He certainly has that power. There were those two versions of the band around 2004 and then the reunion in 2008 and as you say now we have all the great music with a great band. The documentary is dedicated to Doc and Chris as well, two obviously integral members.
John: We really wanted that. And look there will be people who will say “There’s not enough Doc in there” or “There’s not enough Chris” or whatever, but I personally think it’s really balanced. I know that Kieran Neeson who was there at the opening night at the Adelaide Film Festival. He came over from Sydney for that and after the film he came and shook my hand and said that too – that he thought it was balanced. And I think it was: Doc is very well represented in the movie. It probably concentrates a little bit on Rick and me at the end, but we’re the last men standing (laughs) so it kind of had to. But I think Doc was well represented by his sons and also some pieces that were recorded of Doc talking about things.
Mark: There was some great footage in there and some things I’d not seen before which was great.
John: And some weird stuff!
Mark: There was but we’ll not spoil that. It is well worth seeing – people should get out and catch it while they can. And over the next couple of years look out for hints about that 50th celebration. I know back in 1979 it was noted that you did 330 gigs in a year and whilst we may not hit that mark again, you’re working very hard this year, you’re everywhere at the minute and you’ve been out West to see us quite a few times.
John: Yeah with the Red Hot Summer, One Electric Day and then The Charles earlier in the year, we love The Charles and the Ravenswood Hotel. We’ve always loved Western Australia, we’ve done tours in the Pilbara region that were wonderful and we love going down South.
Mark: And of course the Symphony. There’s so much going on in The Angels camp with shows like that, now the documentary and the ongoing revisiting of the catalogue. Is there anything that you would still love to do or shall we leave that till the Anniversary?
John: Well we have a new album too in the can as they say. We’re just working on finishing that at the moment and I think it’s terrific. We do like to do new albums, though we know they’re not going to get radio exposure. I understand that, even bands like The Rolling Stones and AC/DC find it hard to get played when they do new stuff. But that doesn’t mean that we shouldn’t continue to make new music.
Mark: Absolutely. Rock music has never really been mainstream flavour of the year and the thrill of the live show continues. One thing I really have enjoyed over the last few years is the reworking of the old albums. It may not make you a huge amount of money but the fans love it.
John: It’s a thing to do that just by doing it you actually point up those albums. And you point up the original albums as much as us doing a new take on them. But it’s something that we wanted to share with everyone and also share with Sam and Nick. There are three brilliant albums and I love them all in their own way: ‘Face to Face’, ‘No Exit and ‘Dark Room’, though that’s not to say that there weren’t great moments on the later records, but those three were with the original line up with Buzz (Graham Bidstrup) and Chris (Bailey). I’m not saying they were better than anyone else, because I’m proud of anyone who has played in The Angels including the time when I wasn’t in it! But those years were pretty special and we were reunited in ’93 and there was another seven years of that line up. But hey (Laughs) it was and it continues to be an amazing ride. There’s not too many bands that make 50 years and I’m pretty proud of that.
Mark: Let’s hope we have a smooth ride till we get there and no more nonsense like Covid or things like that. It was a hard time for everyone in music.
John: Yeah that was a hard one but my sympathies lie in particular with roadies and tour managers and promoters. We were kind of OK because we’d done 20 Red Hot Summers before the Covid curtain came down and you know there’s always a positive side to whatever happens. That’s when I started doing all these walks along the sea front here in Victor Harbour. Peter Hanlon and I started doing all these long walks and that’s where the move came from. I did some gigs sitting where I am right now with an acoustic guitar and a microphone. What I wanted to say was that me as a professional musician, I was OK, a lot of others weren’t. Jackson Browne said it all when he said those guys are the champs, we couldn’t do it without those guys.
Mark: They absolutely are. It’s been a wonderful 48 years so far and I can’t wait for the 50th Celebrations.
John: Thank you so much Mark.
Mark: It’s always a pleasure to speak to you John enjoy Christmas and the New Year and we will see you in 2023.
John: Thank you Mark. See you soon. I look forward to it.